Which is the goal of the very populists they voted for…
This is how Trumps get ellected
A Trump was elected here but he fucked it all up within a year without even having managed to improve or ruin anything.
We have good hopes the next government is gonna get it right.
We have good hopes the next government is gonna get it right.
Wait what? Where do those hopes come from?
Political options aren’t ruined by two-party system, so there’s flexibility.
Options and diversity generally results in progress and balance.
Well… We’ve had this system for some time now and we can’t really say our government is super stable lately. In fact, the splintering pretty much makes it impossible to set a clear course. Plus, most parties make hot button issues their hill to die on so they’ll just pull ultimatums all the time and threaten to blow up the government if they don’t get what they want. Even if the Algemene Rekenkamer tells everyone that their plans are inexecutable.
Sure, there are options, but they’re not terribly different from last time. It’s always possible to get something great, but I don’t see how hopes are particularly higher now than they were e.g. at the last elections.
I figured at least a couple of the PVV voters are so disillusioned they’ll just not vote this time.
On the one hand I’m not sure if that’s such good news (I don’t like the PVV, but I do think it’s important that citizens are involved in how the country is governed), and on the other hand I’m not even sure that it’s true. They’re still polling strong.
They won’t rule any more, that’s true, but they’ll make it harder to former a stable government, and still have strong influence on the policy that does get enacted. Compared to e.g. any election before the last one, I see no signs that make me particularly hopeful.
Wilders is our Trump
Geert Wilders from the Netherlands
Boris Johnson from the UK
And of course Donald Trump from the USIt really is impressive how these fascist assclowns look alike
Here you have the German version (Björn Höcke). He has yet to start his power grab, maybe 2029 or, for maximum irony, 2033, exactly 100 years after his great idol…His surname is Bernd, don’t be mean to him
There is another german bernd, who doesn’t deserve to share a name with this nazi asshole.
Based Bernd is how I call this lovely loaf of bread.
The Netherlands doesn’t have the First Past the Post system
Neither does Germany and the AfD is still rising so… yeah.
The most extremist-proof voting system I know of is approval voting. Proportional representation is unfortunately not really great at preventing extremism.
I mean, there’s a limit to how much a voting system can do. Western democracies have more fundamental problems.
Is it democracy that has a problem, or is it humans? Take the housing crisis, for example. We want low rents without lotteries, except we also want beautiful cities without commieblocks or even high-rises, and the significant proportion of voters who own their own homes want home values to always increase. And god forbid property taxes forces a retired old person out of a home that’s far larger than what they need. There is just no solution that satisfies all constraints. So we muddle through, mumbling something about “damn foreigners” and “eat the rich”. If we all actually agreed the housing crisis is a problem we’re willing to make sacrifices to solve, then we’d solve it in an instant. But no. Only mimimi.
Is it the “right-wing populists govern in unison with conservative party, ineptly” effect?
Everyone’s good with the media, then. It’s just the political parties they’ve lost faith in.
That means 75% are still in the delusion that anyone cares. That’s a lot higher than I would have thought.
In the US it’s probably what? Atleast half?
This distrust is especially strong among those who voted for Nieuw Sociaal Contract (NSC), with 32 percent expressing no trust, as well as voters for BBB (28 percent) and PVV (26 percent).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Social_Contract
In foreign policy, NSC aspires to continue intensive cooperation within Europe. The idea is that by working together, the Netherlands gets a better grip on cross-border problems such as migration, CO2 emissions and the power of big tech. Nevertheless, NSC also sees the need to strengthen the democratic legitimacy of European legislation and calls for the European Union to be more transparent and accountable to European citizens. According to its party manifesto, European decision-making must become more transparent and be more focused on upholding the principles of subsidiarity and proportionality. Ultimately, Omtzigt has vowed for a firm stance from the Netherlands in Europe, without creeping transfers of budgets and powers eroding national sovereignty and democratic control, and argues that the Netherlands should protect its interests on the European stage. The party also calls for no more Dutch participation in Eurozone bailouts, less EU influence on Dutch taxation policies and for the Netherlands to opt-out of EU agreements it deems contradictory to Dutch interests. NSC supports Dutch NATO membership and argues for the Netherlands to meet the standard of at least 2% of GDP on defense.[37]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_for_Freedom
PVV’s main issues are migration and critique of Islam. The PVV has proposed banning the Quran and shutting down all mosques in the Netherlands.[7] The party is Eurosceptic[8][9] and favoured withdrawal from the EU until 2024.[10]
So I take it that this is something of a “I voted for either less or no EU and a Netherlands for the Dutch and yet the government hasn’t done any of that!”
NSC had a guy who was tired of lobbying, tired of opacity of government and tired of political games. He is a dude who always had thorough knowledge of dossiers, who went the smart route.
But the PVV are populist blowhards who rely on bashing refugees (not immigrants, the Netherlands relies on immigrants too much) and their skewed statements about the economical costs resonated with voters who give up reading any document after a word with more than two syllables.
So the NSC had to basically water down everything the PVV wanted to do and had no time for any of their own points. Plus you had the VVD and the BBB in there, who are respectively for rich folks and farmers.
This cabinet was always doomed to fail and if the Dutch can’t meet somewhere in the middle and keep splitting the vote between far right and far left, this will keep happening until America invades and we become an overseas colony.
Thanks for the breakdown. What does BBB stand for, politically?
Thanks! So you have not one but two clearly right-wing populist parties? Plus NSC which seems to be a more “salon” version?
Pfff as if. We also have FvD (forum for democracy), and JA21 which split off from FvD because FvD started saying the quiet part out loud
So they are doing direct action to improve their conditions right? Right?
The left runs on vibes and the right doesn’t want to fix anything. That’s not the fault of political parties, but just how different kinds of people think and operate. I don’t have a solution, really. The best I can come up with is: If you don’t like the laws where you live, see if anywhere else has a system you like. If you find something, consider moving there. If you don’t find what you’re dreaming of anywhere in the world then it is probably not (politically?) possible and you’ll just have to cope.
No. This line of thought concedes something to the American neofascist ideologues that I refuse to take seriously as an idea because when you see it plainly stated, not under milquetoast rhetorical wraps… the patent absurdity of the thought gleans true.
What is this idea, this concession? It’s the idea that your only true natural right is what they call the “right of feet” or some other asinine phrase. Technofascists believe you have no natural right other than the right to choose which shitty government you live in.
This isn’t true. Your espousing of the same idea is, similarly, not true. To anyone reading the original doomer comment - don’t let it get you down. You can change your home for the better and just because something doesn’t exist in the real world currently doesn’t mean it is “politically impossible”… think about how many ancient forms of government aren’t found in the world today. Do those constitute something “not politically possible” or are we starting to see the problem here?
People build a better world everyday. If you concede your ability to affect change you sacrifice the most divine nature of man.
I applaud your optimism, and I think in theory you’re right. I just don’t think the odds are in the favor of anyone taking your advice.
You forget the option ‘choose to participate and try to push your city/country closer to the world you dream of’.
I consider myself apolitical for around 20 years. I don’t even vote.
Want me to vote for you?
The people who oppose your interests certainly aren’t apolitical though. 🤷♀️
Your boss and your landlord can do your voting for you I guess.
Won’t vote anyway
As I said. Your boss and landlord will vote. You can trust them to represent your interests. Clearly.
The word “idiot” was originally conceived to mean someone apolitical. Its meaning drifted for a reason.
Won’t vote anyway
